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yussuf2005 [ PM ]
4 December 2005 02:33
Salamu Alaykum,

Pour ceux qui désirent immigrer au canada, avant d'entamer n'importe quelle étape, veuillez consulter le site suivant pour savoir plus sur la réalité de la vie ici:



SVP ne croyez les sites officiels et les avocats

For those who are willing to come and settle in Canada, please before doing any step, check out this website to know about what you can really expect from here :



plz don t believe the official websites and lawyers

lhadok lli baghyen yejiou ye3icho fi canada wella rahoma daf3in dossier, qbel ma diro aye haja Allah yerda 3likum chofo had site :



Allah yerhem lwadine matyeqouch ghir les avocats we les sites dial gouv.

Je fais ça juste pour sauver les familles de mes compatriotes bien installées au Maroc ou ailleurs.

Am just doing in the sake of Allah to save those families leaving in peace of mind there and surely leading a quiete life from desastrous futures.

Kandir hadchi fi sabil Allah bach n-hader ossar dial mgharba li 3aychine meziane fi lblad wella fi l europe.

Thanks, Merci, Chokran :-)
mimine31400 [ PM ]
4 December 2005 12:13
tu n'a pas tord...
fabaraw [ PM ]
4 December 2005 21:55
Thanks yusuuf for the infos,
i totally agree with you it is very hard here but i guess the key to make it is to be willing to start somewhere and with your hard work you will work your way up i assume but for sure that doesnt happen overnight .... a lot of patience .... but lets wish the best of luck to everyone
aziz_dk [ PM ]
6 December 2005 10:09
Hi everybody

I guess around 60% of Moroccan knows that is a big risk to take, to leave your job or familly and chase a dream in Canada.

you can show them any kind of document, tv program people will tell them them there story they will listen, but as far one stupid will tell them that live is easy they will believe him and the hope a raise again.

I make up my mind never advise anybody of not to go.if any body ask my advise i will tell try to know, cause if you tell him the truth he will tænk you are let them try!!

Dream of living large is killing everybody, I dont blame them, you see how immigrant behave in the summer in Moroccan.

I know what kind of immigrant that like to show, but for lot of them he was a full in Morocco and he made it ...why not the them..


Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2005 10:10 by aziz_dk.
Georgina [ PM ]
6 December 2005 10:28

Aziz i agree completely, although i was never in marocco, the friends of fattah, when they go back to the bled for summer or Christmas holiday they bring loads of money, and a i mean a lot, they go with big cars that eventually they buy second or third hands just to show off, re selling it again once they come back.... and a great number of present for everybody and in this way they show to the youngsters that it is fairly easy to make money.
Now Fattah's brother wants to leave casablanca too...he is studying there but cant cope, seeing some others like you said "showing off"
Why the majority arent honest and tell the truth? That: most of the time they have to share small flats with other people, without a woman in the house they dont even clean the flat, believe me i have seen certain terrible situations with my own eyes....they dont eat properly and eventually they deal drugs?

Some people go back to Marocco each summer with 6/7000 Euro (as a minimum!) cash on top of sending real money every months through Western Union.

There is the need to explain to young generation back home that through hard and honest work AND saving you can live a honourable life of course but Easter's eggs dont come easily.
cali [ PM ]
6 December 2005 17:01
I guess everybody wants to take a shotcut to happines and more compfortable life. That is what makes people take the risk, and go abroud to every price. Yes off course people needs to go out , see things, see how other people solve their problems and get some experience and get back to their countries to start something for example. It´s a good idea, but it´s fatal as soon as people geopardize everything to get away from their countries. I think everybody is responsable, some emigrants thenselves, the media both in Europe and third countries, politicians etc...
There should be a plan to stop this epidemy and make emigration countries more attractiv, and give people back hope in their countries.


Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things.

Russell Baker
Yani [ PM ]
7 December 2005 06:15
I might be in bad mood while responding to this thread, but I strongly think that there's no dignity or self respect left for/ in those who want to leave at all cost! It's a puzzling game that the youth, and worst of all, the older community, are playing. I'm familiar with ppl working for different ministries making tons of money in morocco who are willing to sell "their" villas... and move to Canada or the sattes.
Like Aziz, I am done advising those who want to leave. The reastion is "we made it here, and don't want them to engulf the Gold that's out here for the taking! Ludicrous. I pity those who are not making it here and can't go back because they are embarassed...fact is we developed this tendency to LIVE for OTHERS and forgot to live for's more the PLEASING of AUTRUI that ruined us.
Shame on those who go for a brief stay in MOrocco and can't stop going up and down the Boulevards showing off thier fruity handbags and tooting their horns at "girls" and Boys... It's more of " We want to go to that promised land and get back at you attitude" that's assaulting the minds who are restless in lebled.
IT's the responsibility of the GOVERNMENT to stop looting the wealth of the contry and invest in the youth of this country, seriously. Honor the contract they signed instead of breaking the immigrants' backs taxing them and leaving them to pay for those who want to cross the Atlantic or the strait of Gibraltar! It is also the responsibility of those who are sitting on their behind and in cafe(s) wating for GODOT to bring them a contract to get to the promissed land just to humiliate themselves and loose every shred of dignity their parents might have instilled in them.
Both politicians and the Individuals thinking about leaving are respoinsible.
Morocco is a Farm of Cash flow that's uncontrolled and it's all in favor of the crooks in the Government.
What a shame. Immagine a one year boycot by the immigrants " NO dime sent or spent in MOrocco"! That'll get ppl to reconsider many a plan to move or take the immigrant or immigration for granted!
I don't think I've ever been this upset responding to a topic in this Forum.
Shame on the decision makers in that government of ours and shame on the lazy youth!
cali [ PM ]
8 December 2005 02:33
wow Yani, it´s some deep stuff you wrote. I do agree with you on some points. It´s a bit like them telling us come back home and invest in your country while they are re-taking back the money you just brought with you to Morocco, back to Where they came from to be re-invested. You see the governement is not alone responsable. Everybody is responsable. People complain about corruption, but as soon as they are in trouble or they need some licence, they would be willing to pay ruther than respect the rules. The issue is not how you want people to treat you, but how do you treat people. The governement is people too, that shows that any other Moroccan would have done the same as the Minister or whoever, if he himself was in their place. This idea of abuse of power, corruption, not being honnestetc... most come from somewhere.


Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things.

Russell Baker
Yani [ PM ]
9 December 2005 01:08
Hi Cali;

First of all, sorry for the typos all over my first response! I take this topic too seriously, Iguess!
Now, I think we agree on all the points, and I'll add to the fact that the Governemet as being "people"! YEs it is, but the fact that they are getting paid to manage the population adds to thier responsibility! Corruption...must come from somewhere, you say! I agree, and I put, just like you said, THE GOVERNEMENT as THE FIRST responsible and the THE INDIVIDUALS as second; THAT'S WHY they are called LEADERS and "RO3at". DRAFTING A BILL IN THE PARLEMENT about these kinds of atrocities and inhumane treatment of Honest, but WEAK, citiczens, is the least they can do and reinforcing the Law...THe Intiative must come from somewhere, I say the LEaders, if not it's chaos, and that's what thereality is now.

cali [ PM ]
9 December 2005 02:22
There is no doubt that the responsable heads and leaders are really responsable. You´ll find some responsables in the governement who´s title is responsable de.....and who denies any responsability on anything that goes wrongEye rolling smiley Then why are you responsable? I know that they are more responsable then people, and they should be an example. This a kind of who came first, the egg or the chiken. If people doesn´t demand their rights there will be some wolves waiting for them to forget about it. A corrupt governement wouldn´t last one day in scandinavia for ex. I read once a slogan in an office of a union overhere. It says; Do your duty, demand your rights! Which means that by demanding your rights you do the society and yourself a favour. Don´t get me wrong, I don´t say that the governement and other powerfull heads in Morocco aren´t responsable of all this mess.


Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things.

Russell Baker
Ilhem2 [ PM ]
14 December 2005 03:48
hi everybody,

I just want to add that most of Moroccans in this forum and many other compatriots in different countries before us wanted to leave the country for some reason (studies, work experience, better life…ect). Once arrive in the destination and after confronting many problems I’m sure that most of us regretted it and hoped to go back when they get what they came for. But the fact is that none of us (or at least the majority) didn’t do it!!!!!! So I’m wondering how people will believe us when we tell them that maybe it’s not worth to leave the country if we still are not able to come back!? I think the first question they will ask is: if it’s better to stay in Morocco why are we still living in other country? I personally can not answer this question or at least with strong arguments because I feel I’m not an example to give them the right advise! In this case their desire to leave the country is legitime...

In my opinion, as long as we don’t do ourselves what we “recommend” others to do ... We can hardly be credible...which is logical actually...
Amadou [ PM ]
14 December 2005 18:42
mais c partout comme ça, partout.


yussuf2005 [ PM ]
15 December 2005 16:49
Salamo Alaycom,
I understand what do you mean by you can t be an example...sometimes it s so hard to go back and loose the s a social issue...
But the thing we need to get here is that we are not looking to oblige our compatriots to stop thinking about immigration, or immigrate ...we are asking them to make the right decision by learning about previous experiences...if they want to learn by experience they can do it...everybody is responsible for his acts...our job here is educate people that s it..
give your experience
give infos, websites...
and let them know
Yani [ PM ]
16 December 2005 03:49
HI All;

Some valid questions are asked but answered indirectly, in my view.
ILham2; I beleive your message is an answer to your question! Valid is the desire of ppl to move from their homeland to another "rosy" location! but what you're doing and ultimately, we 're doing is drawing attention to the problematic cases that might arise once in a while, to be on the positive side. Yes, everybody has the right to experience Immigration on their own, and I wish I had the mentoring I used to offer after my experience. I stopped advising or giving advice on what and how to do things for obvious reasons! People want to you to tell them what they want to hear!i.e paint everything Pink!

Reasons for Immigration differ,as you all have presented, but the preparation is not there, or lacking in most cases! How many are willing and do take off without references or qualifications...those are the ones that end up on the streets or doing menial jobs, not that there's anything wrong with that, but it was my understanding that one moved to improve not to regress!

As an individual, I related my story to those who asked, but no matter how successful or not I was in doing so, I was still one voice, and not one of authority! THat's why I was suggesting the issue be taken care of by the leaders of the countrymen more prone to falling in the cyclone of immigration trouble(S).

It's a serious issue that rises to Human exploitation and must be taken to higher courts so the people will listen, both exploited, the uneducated (less prepared) immigrants, and the ones exploiting them, "host" countries!

yussuf2005 [ PM ]
22 December 2005 16:41
some comments from

Dec 19, 2005

Canadians are too innocent of the world happening around us. In the international arena, Canada is far from a major key-player. Please refer to WTO's latest statistics. Our GDP growth, GDP per capita, world's economy/trade/services/tourism standings are even much lower than the small island of Hong Kong. It's unfortunate that due to the very heavy taxations, Canadians after footing daily necessaties ie food, housing, car, little or nothing is left to any savings. Thus many Canadians never in their life time could afford to travel around the world to see the fast changing pace of the arena. Indeed, Canada is the most sparsely populated on earth, resulting taxation per capita being one of the highest.

We should all be grateful for anyone who's willing to come to this remote, no activities, quiet, cold and harsh land to help develop our economy and help out in our heavy taxes.

Apart from refugees, majority of Immigrants are from the wealthy and skilled categories who are very much respected in their homeland. For instance an investment Immigrant from Hong Kong is required to put down CAD$500,000 in cash in exchange for the status, how many of us here got this kind of cash in our bank accounts?

Immigrants in the old days, esp those after the 2nd WW who fled here because of Nazis' and fascists' defeats just cannot be compared with the wealthy and professional immigrants of today. The world has changed alot since then. These rich and skilled immigrants are welcomed by many countries around the world, including the US. If we continue to be hostile to our newcomers, the end result is that our very sparse population just have to share a greater burden of the taxes.

It's also unfortunate that Canada has been too heavily depending on our South neighbour for well being. We talk and think like an American, in contrary to Canadians, our S. neighbour is a genuine world player and repected multi cultures, reasons being the US has the most no. of multi national corporations around the globe, giving Americans numerous opportunities to travel, live and understand different cultures of the world. Because of their broad scope and knowledge on international affairs and perspectives, Americans at home respect and treasure skilled and talented from around the world. On the other hand, because Canadians dont have that same opportunities to travel and live outside of the country, making mostly Canadians very naive and ignorant of the outside world. If we do not change our perceptions, Canada will continue to fall behind the world's competitiveness.

J. White
[email protected]

yussuf2005 [ PM ]
22 December 2005 16:43
some comments from





Please enter your comments:
I agree that when the immigrants do not find appropriate jobs they cry out of racism/discrimination. I agree that a new immigrant's overseas educational/professional background has little meaning in Canada/USA. So, in the race of job market (which is unthinkably meagre in Canada)they get easily denied with the locals (as there are lots of experienced born Canadians are always available in the market. But you have to acknowledge that those immigrants are here because they are invited here by their qualifications, they just didn't come here and took refuge. When an immigrant comes from an under developed country, they come with a high hope and after coming into Canada all of a sudden it breaks. You must have to agree that it is not entirely their fault, rather fault of Canada itself who is still inviting those professional for nothing. But sad thing is that, even with a Canadian degree immigrants are not finding jobs here. Look at me, I moved into Canada with a US Masters +2 Years exp. and didn't find any professional level job, then completed my 2nd Masters from the U of T (Regarded as the best school in Canada!). What was the outcome? The same. Then I started looking into the US again and ended up with several jobs within few days. The story is not unique to me; many of my class mates who even graduated before me are still doing under jobs and forwarding their resume to me. I should take a decision that Canada is a racist country. My conclusion is that it is not the question os racism; it is just lack of enough oppurtunities which leads to discrimination/corruption. I must have to say that Americans are far open than the Canadians that's why they are going ahead. I don't think that the condition of the immigrants are so bad in any other countries in the world as Canada. Canadians should be more pragmatic rather than rely on some nice blind statistics. How can a country invite professionals when they dont even have jobs for their own graduates?!
yussuf2005 [ PM ]
22 December 2005 16:44
other comments :

I was an Immigrant



Please enter your comments:
Let me tell you my background first. I am an honours graduate from Pakistan (three years degree), did my Masters from UK. Worked in UK for 5 years in my field & then migrated to Canada.

I chose to live there because I thought, that with the qualifications and experience I have, I wont have any problem finding a job. I was wrong. In the first six months I was hoping to find a good job while working at Tim Hortons & Coffee shop. After six months my hopes started fading but one day I got a phone call, a lucky one. It was a contract opportunity actually it was something I did finishing my education but still it was something that belong to my field. A three months contract fly by and I was jobless again. Long story short in my endeavour to find a job in Canada was so tough that I decided to leave Canada. I set a deadline for me that if I dont find a job by that date I am off. The deadline date was 28th of February. The last interview I went to was Scotia Bank, on 16th of Feb. I didn't hear anything from them by 28th, 3rd of March I left Canada, broke my PR Card and had a final look at Canada from the aircraft Window.

On 8th of March when I was sitting in my home in Lahore, a letter was dropped by postman. My friend forwarded it for me from Canada. I was a job offer from Scotia Bank, they offered me CDN$ 78,000 per year for a permanent position with all other benefits.

I dont regret leaving Canada (I still can go back but I wont), I am happy that I left it. That 78000 dollar job is useless for me because I know there might be a lay off waiting for me six months after starting the job.

I took a brave step, not all immigrants can do that, but if you can, dont think anything else just DO IT.

Good luck
montreal_1 [ PM ]
26 December 2005 02:32
I live in Canada. Canada is good for

- Studies
- Young people looking for adventure

Canada is not good for

- someone who has a GOOD JOB and good financial situation in Morocco
bropatchko [ PM ]
27 December 2005 11:01
OUi khoya, T'as raison, ma3and les marocains maydirou fhad lblad dail walo.
On vient ici pour travailler dans nos domaines respectifs AVEC LESQUEL ON A ETE PRESELECTIONNÉS,et on se retrouve dans les agences de travail pour vider des conteneurs. au meillleurs des cas on arrive a economiser l'argent du billet d'avion pour le maroc(pour une personne seule).
Est ce que ca vaut la peine????NON, NO, LLA, NIET, NÉHÉ, KALLA,
bropatchko [ PM ]
27 December 2005 11:07
yES ,
I AGREE with all of you guys.
all those who live in canada need to take maximum profit from studies and the way of life.(max 2 years).
i'd rather live in tichka(deep morocco) and not waste my life doin' the dirty jobs here(toronto)
Not recommended for famillies
fabaraw [ PM ]
27 December 2005 16:02
Boy this is very depressing Smiling Smiley well come on guys Morocco is not heaven either. I moved back to morocco in the year 2000 I wanted to live the rest of my life there ... and whenever i go for interviews the first question was WHY ARE YOU HERE???? WHY DID YOU LEAVE THE STATES???? for God's sake this is my country and i have the right to come back whenever i want to and guess what finding a good job there is not a peice of cake ..... so lets get the best of what this countries are giving us and leave it FI YADI ALLAH who knows what the future hides but dont lose hope.

The times may seem dark & gloomy... but I know I have it on me, to make it to brighter days --- never lose hope
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